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| Posted by skipwallace555 uskidscompute.com 5/27/2003 08:45:31 Play online chess |  Subject: BOBBY FISCHERMessage: where are you. I feel robbed because the person who got me into chess is no longer available to us. Who does he keep in touch with in the United States, does anybody know? I read an article recently that he lived with the Polgar family and gives interviews on the radio in Manilla but I have heard nothing else for awhile. It seems to me that F.I.D.E. should try harder to bring him back to us. Either by backing a special tournament or perhaps the computer company could have a man vs. machine contest. We are all being deprived of seeing a Master play. What a shame! |
| Posted by myway316 uskidscompute.com 5/27/2003 09:50:40 Play online chess | Fischer? Good riddance to bad garbage! Message: Fischer severed his ties to the US,and to anybody in this country he ever knew. I would say "cared for",but as we all know,Bobby never gave a damn about anybody but his own,hate-filled self. Fischer claims he will never play the "old" chess again,as he feels it is played out. The truth,and Bobby knows it,is that he would get his sorry butt kicked by any real GM now on the circuit. Nobody wants Fischer,except for the US Dept of the Treasury. Let him rot in whatever hole he's crawled into, and chew on all his tired,hate-filled delusions. If I sound bitter,I am. I,too,got into chess because of Fischer,and what did he do to promote the phenomena he started? Nothing! When I think of all Fischer could have done to keep the explosive interest in chess that he created going,it makes me sick.But what can you except from a paranoid,selfish SOB,who found people only useful so long as they kissed his butt? Take a hint from me,Skip,find yourself another,more deserving player to be your chessic role-model-Fischer stopped being worthy of notice 31 years ago. |
| Posted by verticalchess uskidscompute.com 5/27/2003 17:11:41 Play online chess | HERE, HERE - well said Message: I agree he abandoned the game and the people who loved him so much. He is not worthy of being held in such a high regard after turning his back on the chess world! ——— Larry Evans, the Chess Player — Larry Melvyn Evans, who died Monday at 78, is justly hailed for his role in helping Bobby Fischer win the world chess championship in 1972 and for his productive career as a writer. But he also had a substantial record as a chess player and won the United States Championship five times. He was never the country’s top player. He was overshadowed when he was younger by Samuel Reshevsky (against whom he had a large negative score), then by Bobby Fischer and finally by a whole new generation, led by Yasser Seirawan and Larry Christiansen. Dr. Anthony Saidy, an international master who knew Evans well, said that growing up in the United States probably handicapped Evans in terms of his chess ... |
| Posted by jean-marc uskidscompute.com 5/27/2003 18:38:32 Play online chess | Just a minute, guys... Message: We've had this Fischer discussion on other threads.. I'm not Fischer's greatest fan, but I suggest we should be careful before starting such vitriolic attacks on the guy... OK, he didn't defend the title in 1975. It was a great disappointment to me too. I was 15 y-o and he was like a god to me ! All I can say is that we never really heard his side of the story. From my experience, it's really dangerous believing the media in everything they write, especially when it only comes from one side. Personally, I suspect that Fischer is not always wrong. Look at the way he's been treated for playing in Yugoslavia. Is that really such a crime ? ...and look at the way all his precious possessions have been impounded and sold. He's now constantly being plagiarised and his works used without any form of copyright being paid. Personally, I can see why anyone would feel persecuted with this type of treatment. About those (in)famous radio interviews. I suggest let's be careful. These things can easily be faked, edited, or quoted out of context. By the way (not that I necessarily agree with them but), his comments on the Palestinian and Iraq issues have been made by plenty others before. Personally, I'm amazed how the media can build someone as the great white hope of the free world against those nasty communists and then vilify him when it suits and turn him into Satan. ——— Aronian Wins World Blitz Chess Championship — Levon Aronian is having a pretty good month. Actually, he’s have a pretty good year. Aronian, an Armenian chess grandmaster, who has recently risen to No. 3 in the world (along the way becoming only the sixth player to crack the 2,800 rating level), won the World Blitz Championship in Moscow on Thursday. The victory followed his tie for first in the Tal Memorial, which ended Sunday, and his recent stellar performances at the European Club Cup, where he scored 4.5 out of 6 points, and the Chess Olympiad in Khanty-Mansiysk, Russia, in which he scored 7.5 out of 10. In the blitz championship — where each player started with three minutes and had two seconds added to their time after each ... |
| Posted by myway316 uskidscompute.com 5/27/2003 18:58:01 Play online chess | Fischer never turned into satan,Jean-Marc... Message: ...he was born that way. As for those radio interviews,they were all live,so the whole world(if they bothered to listen)got to hear,over and over again,ad nauseum,Fischer's incoherent,venom spewing,profanity filled chants of hate against the Jews. No matter what the topic,it took about an average of 5 seconds before Fischer would start chewing the same old worn-out soupbone of his being persecuted by the Jews,the Justice Dept.,the Russians,his dentist,the wino down the block,Jimmy Hoffa,the Morman Tabernacle Choir,and the man from Mars. As for his books,Fischer did get his royalties from some countries,especially Russia,who supposedly paid him $100,000. His trip to Yugoslavia can be put down to an arrogant disdain for bureaucratic bluenoses,but when he applauds 9/11,simply because it happened here in the US,as the late Mr. Rogers would say:"Do you know how to spell T-R-A-I-T-O-R?" Wouldn't surprize me if they found him hanging out with Osama Camel Breath and the rest of those Al-Queda jihad jackasses. ——— Interview With the President of the World Chess Federation, Part 3 — After his recent re-election as president of the World Chess Federation, Kirsan Ilyumzhinov offered to answer questions from readers of The Times about the federation, which is also known by the acronym FIDE (for Fédération Internationale des Échecs), and about his plans for the future of the game. Supporting Chess Development. Question: Some readers say the Committee for Assistance to Chess Developing Countries has done little or nothing to assist some countries or regions where there is little money and few skilled players. Your response? Fortunately they are mistaken. Thanks to the activities of the committee, all developing countries receive financial and technical help on a regular basis. I would note that ... |
| Posted by a_professional_idiot uskidscompute.com 5/27/2003 19:01:34 Play online chess | indicted Message: "Look at the way he's been treated for playing in Yugoslavia. Is that really such a crime ?" Well actually, yes. He is still wanted by US forces for violating orders and going to play Spassky. That is why he has turned so anti-American... he is a fugitive for playing a chess match. ——— Interview With the President of the World Chess Federation, Part 2 — After his recent re-election as president of the World Chess Federation, Kirsan Ilyumzhinov offered to answer questions from readers of The Times about the federation, which is also known by the acronym FIDE (for Fédération Internationale des Échecs), and about his plans for the future of the game. Question: Title matches and candidates events have been delayed, postponed and moved multiple times in the last few years because of organizational confusion. How do you plan to fix these problems? I must correct you: After we shifted to the match system for the world champion title, it was played in accordance with the approved FIDE schedule. That was the case with the unified matches between ... |
| Posted by bluebabygirl uskidscompute.com 5/27/2003 19:25:31 Play online chess | to any Message: here is my humble thinking on the latest fischer argument no not discussion because you can not discuss HIM without it turning into an argument usaully violent literrally speaking . ok the us government had absolutely no right to interfer with his playing Spassky . then no right to steal, and sell all his personal property!! Therefore just maybe it is best to see a little of his side , after all if government did you that way i think you would be very very upset too!! So my way of dealing with it is -- hate him all you want if you chose but do not foolishly try to downgrade ,abuse or lie about HIS CHESS !!!!! just let his chess speak for itself. thats my thinking and I will not bother any you guys with a poem on this occasion , yours bluebabygirl -- p,s, by the way it just totally pssss me off when people try to trash his or any other great players chess simply because they do not like the player . hope this makes sense to someone !! ——— President of World Chess Federation Responds to Readers’ Questions — The president of the World Chess Federation says he hopes to open a chess academy in New York City in the near future and double the number of people who play chess worldwide. And, yes, he believes that the game was invented by extraterrestrials. Those are some of the comments from Kirsan Ilyumzhinov, 48, president of the chess federation — which is also known by the acronym FIDE for its name in French, Fédération Internationale des Échecs — who last week responded to questions submitted by Gambit readers. On Sept. 29, Mr. Ilyumzhinov was re-elected to a four-year term at the Chess Olympiad held in Khanty-Mansiysk, Russia; he has led the federation since 1995. Though Mr. Ilyumzhinov ... |
| Posted by jean-marc uskidscompute.com 5/27/2003 19:53:20 Play online chess | Ok... Message: Alright guys, I see the Fischer topic always will attract strong emotions. I've had my say and I realise that not everyone will agree. ...so, I'll leave it there before we're no longer friends. Cheers, Jean-Marc |
| Posted by skipwallace555 uskidscompute.com 5/27/2003 20:35:21 Play online chess | bluebabygirl Message: makes perfect sense to me! |
| Posted by coyotefan uskidscompute.com 5/27/2003 21:05:13 Play online chess | a_professional_idiot Message: He was a fugitive before this. Income tax evasion among other charges. He also exiled himself. The truth is that he is insane. There is no other rational explanation for his anti-Semitic, anti-American, anti-chess, anti-everything attitude. He lost his marbles. He is someone to feel sorry for, but certainly not someone to worship. |
| Posted by rtrider uskidscompute.com 5/27/2003 21:35:13 Play online chess | game of the century Message: you can hate the man,but must love his game! david byrne vs bobby fischer 1956 a daring queen sacrifice,for a relentless attack with minor pieces.all the while keeping every one of his pieces defended.truly a beautiful game... and back in 56 he was only about 13 years old.. look at this game,i hope the great bobby fischer is still playing somewhere..... |
| Posted by peppe_l uskidscompute.com 5/28/2003 03:21:04 Play online chess | It is strange Message: So many people saw Bobby Fischer as a "great American hero" - the truth is he was a fantastic chess player, but never cared much about representing his country etc. I suppose it was necessary to boost the moral during Cold War, but as a result many people believe Fischer was something he never was. Of course, since 1972 he has taken several steps towards insanity, but surprisingly much of what he says is really a more radical version of his opinions before 1972 (being anti-something never comes from nowhere, let alone borns from sheer evil...even though in some cases, for simplicity, people want to see things in that way). That is one of the reasons why I am not qualified to say whether hes insane or not. Everyone can make an own judgement after listening the radio interviews so many are talking about. They should be somewhere as mp3s, but let me warn you - they are mostly his ranting about jews etc. |
| Posted by tombro uskidscompute.com 5/28/2003 06:31:43 Play online chess | If you look closer... Message: ...beyond his rantings, you will most likely see a perfect clinical case of adult onset schizophrenia, which explains things like his removal of dental fillings, believing that Russia was transmitting moves to Spassky, etc. I believe he was moving this way even back then, during the 1972 match, only to fall in the bottomless pit afterwards. Truly a pity, but not the first great chessplayer to dissolve into insanity, ie, Morphy. |
| Posted by peppe_l uskidscompute.com 5/28/2003 07:16:17 Play online chess | Not to forget Steinitz Message: Who also lost his mental health. In his last days Steinitz actually wanted to challenge no lesser opponent than God himself to a game of chess. Despite of offering pawn and move handicap, his challenge was never accepted. Back to Fischer... Yes he sounds paranoid, no question. But if experts of psychology cant reach an agreement considering his mental health, who am I to argue? :-) |
| Posted by rtrider uskidscompute.com 5/28/2003 07:38:28 Play online chess | ask nigel Message: ask nigel short about fischer's mental state! did short get blown out by fischer playing speed chess on the internet? i don't know?..... but nigel says he is 99 percent sure it was fischer. and short has beaten gary k at the speed game! |
| Posted by bogg uskidscompute.com 5/28/2003 13:03:42 Play online chess | reply to indicted Message: RJF playing in Yugoslavia was only illegal because he didn't ask for the waiver that is nearly always granted in his circumstance. If the only offer of income you have is in a state under embargo you will receive a waiver by simply asking. As I understand it an offer of significantly less money does not count. Additionally, as I remeber it, he was in no trouble for tax evasion until he volunteered that he had been evading payment of same. |
| Posted by tulkos uskidscompute.com 5/28/2003 13:12:28 Play online chess | LOL. Message: Question::: Did Fischer try to emulate Morphy? |
| Posted by peppe_l uskidscompute.com 5/28/2003 13:35:09 Play online chess | Just for the record Message: In one of his radio interviews Fischer claimed he DID apply for special permission allowing him to play Spassky. However, despite of such permission being given to US Chess Federation (for buying books from Yugoslavian publisher, Sahovski), his request was declined. The rest we know, he got a warning letter before the match but decided to play anyway... For those who are interested, here is the warning letter... *** Department of the Treasury Washington Aug 21, 1992 Order to Provide Information and Cease and Desist Activities FAC No. 129405 Dear Mr Fischer: It has come to our attention that you are planning to play a chess match for a cash prize in the Federal Republic of Yugoslavia (Serbia and Montenegro) (hereinafter "Yugoslavia") against Boris Spassky on or about September 1, 1992. As a U.S. citizen, you are subject to the prohibitions under Executive Order 12810, dated June 5, 1992, imposing sanctions against Serbia and Montenegro. The United States Department of the Treasury, Office of Foreign Assets Control ("FAC"), is charged with enforcement of the Executive Order. The Executive Order prohibits U.S. persons from performing any contract in support of a commercial project in Yugoslavia, as well as from exporting services to Yugoslavia. The purpose of this letter is to inform you that the performance of your agreement with a corporate sponsor in Yugoslavia to play chess is deemed to be in support of that sponsor's commercial activity. Any transactions engaged in for this purpose are outside the scope of General License No. 6, which authorizes only transactions to travel, not to business or commercial activities. In addition, we consider your presence in Yugoslavia for this purpose to be an exportation of services to Yugoslavia in the sense that the Yugoslav sponsor is benefitting from the use of your name and reputation. Violations of the Executive Order are punishable by civil penalties not to exceed $10,000 per violation, and by criminal penalties not to exceed $250,000 per individual, 10 years in prison, or both. You are hereby directed to refrain from engaging in any of the activities described above. You are further requested to file a report with this office with 10 business days of your receipt of this letter, outlining the facts and circumstances surrounding any and all transactions relating to your scheduled chess match in Yugoslavia against Boris Spassky. The report should be addressed to: The U.S. Department of the Treasury, Office of Foreign Assets Control, Enforcement Division, 1500 Pennsylvania Avenue, N.W., Annex - 2nd floor, Washington D.C. 20220. If you have any questions regarding this matter, please contact Merete M. Evans at (202) 622-2430. Sincerely, R. Richard Newcomb Director Office of Foreign Assets Control Mr. Bobby Fischer c/o Hotels Stefi Stefan (Room. 118) 85 315 Stefi Stefan Montenegro, Yugoslavia cc: Charles P. Pashayan, Jr., Esq. 1418 33rd St., N.W. Washington, DC 20007 Choate & Choate Attorneys at Law The Pacific Mutual Building 523 West Sixth Street Suite 541 Los Angeles, CA 90014 U.S. Embassy Belgrade, Yugoslavia *** ...Federal Grand Jury Indictment... *** Federal Grand Jury Indictment of Bobby Fischer United States District Court for the District of Columbia Holding a Criminal Term Grand Jury Sworn on October 29, 1991 UNITED STATES of AMERICA vs. ROBERT JAMES FISCHER Criminal No. Grand Jury Original Violation 50 USC §§1701, 1702, and 1705 (International Emergency Economic Powers Act ) INDICTMENT The Grand Jury Charges that: From on or about July 11, 1992 to on or about November 5, 1992, within the jurisdiction of the District of Columbia and elsewhere, the defendant ROBERT JAMES FISCHER, a United States person, did knowingly and willfully perform a contract in support of a commercial project in the Federal Republic of Yugoslavia (Serbia and Montenegro), in that the defendant ROBERT JAMES FISCHER did enter into and perform a contract between the defendant, the Jugoskandic Company of Belgrade, Yugoslavia and Boris Spassky to participate in the "World Chess Championship Match" in the Federal Republic of Yugoslavia (Serbia and Montenegro), for a cash purse of $5 million in United States currency and a percentage of revenues from the commercial gain as a result of the performance of the aforementioned contract. ( In violation of Title 50 USC §§1701, 1702, and 1705 and Executive Order 12810) A TRUE BILL: FOREPERSON. Jay B. StephansDall Attorney of the United States in and for the District of Columbia *** ...And Federal Warrant... *** Federal Warrant for the Arrest of Bobby Fischer Warrant for Arrest Dickey J. United States District Court for the District of Columbia ------------------------------------- UNITED STATES of AMERICA vs. ROBERT JAMES FISCHER ------------------------------------- Criminal No. CR 92-475-01 GJC Name and Address of Person to be Arrested: ROBERT JAMES FISCHER No Known Address NO PDID DOB: 3/9/43 To U.S. Marshall or any authorized agent: YOU ARE HEREBY COMMANDED to arrest the above named person and bring that person before the nearest available magistrate to answer the charge(s) listed below: Description of Charge: 50 USC §§1701, 1702, and 1705 INTERNATIONAL EMERGENCY ECONOMIC POWERS ACT [stamp] received [date illegible] '93 U.S. Marshall Ordered by Patrick U. Atteridge United States Magistrate Judge date 12/15/92 *** Happy reading :-) |
| Posted by nestorix uskidscompute.com 5/28/2003 14:37:17 Play online chess | Thanks to Bobby Fischer... Message: ...many chessplayers can make a living by playing the game. |
| Posted by skipwallace555 uskidscompute.com 5/28/2003 14:56:00 Play online chess | I know Message: all the bad news. I'm only interested in his chess. I think all would pay money to see him play chess today. |
| Posted by rtrider uskidscompute.com 5/28/2003 15:28:46 Play online chess | true Message: skip,i agree 100% |
| Posted by myway316 uskidscompute.com 5/28/2003 17:27:43 Play online chess | Skip and rtrider: Message: I wouldn't pay a dime to see that pathetic twit,so you're wrong when you say all would pay. |
| Posted by badjessie uskidscompute.com 6/24/2003 18:00:45 Play online chess | fischer Message: is the greatest player ever to push a pawn. i would pay more than that to see him play. i would like to seee him defeat kasparov. he could do it easy.. later |
| Posted by peppe_l uskidscompute.com 6/25/2003 03:13:10 Play online chess | Yeah Message: It is easy to beat Kaspy, especially if you were far from 2800+ level more than 10 years ago (in Spassky match 92 his level of play was far from his best days) and havent played chess since. Bring Bobby back, I bet he will give Kaspy queen odds and still win 24-0 |
| Posted by sebazz uskidscompute.com 6/25/2003 04:54:05 Play online chess | probably not Message: Chess has improved the last decades, and he's been out for so long, i guess he's not up to any match... And for his behavior, he's not the only player who went mad... someone in New York (i only know his first name is Israël), played great matches before, but now he's gone 'mad' and behaves a little strange... |
| Posted by baseline uskidscompute.com 6/25/2003 05:21:28 Play online chess | peppe Message: Robert J Fischer represented the U.S at 4 Chess Olympiads for a combined score of +40 -7 =18 a 75.4% score on First Board! How would you view one of your countymen who did the same? rtrider There is no proof that Fischer ever played blitz chess against Nigel Short on the internet just speculation that few people believe. Other than a few media outburst none of know what Fischer is doing or thinking or the state of his mental health Hes 60 years old why would he want to make a comeback now? and what could he possible hope to prove by doing so.? Enjoy and learn from the 1000+ games of his we have because that is all we will ever have from Mr. Fischer. |
| Posted by rommel13 uskidscompute.com 6/25/2003 08:13:35 Play online chess | Great chess Message: for those interested in "The Game of the Century": bobbyfischer.net/0035.html |
| Posted by olympio uskidscompute.com 6/25/2003 08:30:53 Play online chess | i don't Message: consider that the best game of the century. kasparov topalov game.. that game was by far the most brilliant there was nothing special about this game other than that it signalled the beginning of a brilliant career.. just like radjabov's stupid brilliancy price just cause the person he beat was the world champion.. his play was not excellent or brilliant by any means |
| Posted by rommel13 uskidscompute.com 6/25/2003 09:12:13 Play online chess | olympio Message: It wasn't dubbed "The Game of the Century" by me, but rather by Hans Kmoch as the link plainly points out. Further, fascinating match Kasparov Topalov, but it couldn't have been "TGOTC" according to Kmoch since it hadn't happened yet. Kasparov was 7 years from being born. Besides, how old was Kasparov in his match with Topalov?? 36?? Fischer was only 13 when he schooled Byrne. Fan of Fischer or not, getting wiped up by a 13 yr. old in chess makes it a more sensational match than a simple analysis of the moves might indicate, because of the age difference. Both matches were exceptional. |
| Posted by rommel13 uskidscompute.com 6/25/2003 09:16:32 Play online chess | Great chess II Message: For those interested in the other GOTC: medlem.spray.se/tal0/replay/kas-top.htm |
| Posted by peppe_l uskidscompute.com 6/25/2003 10:00:57 Play online chess | Baseline Message: "Robert J Fischer represented the U.S at 4 Chess Olympiads for a combined score of +40 -7 =18 a 75.4% score on First Board! How would you view one of your countrymen who did the same?" I ll tell you IF it happens some day :-) However you have to remember we have somewhat different culture - even though we are very happy if one of our countrymen succeeds it is less important for us compared to Americans. I try my very best not to insult US or US people here but if I exeggarate a bit in many cases Americans have "we are not interested (of a sport or game) until one of our countrymen wins" attitude :-) So if we have our Bobby Fischer one day it will surely have impact on popularity of chess, but it will be nothing compared to chess popularity boost Fischer caused in US. Personally I dont care that much whether our number one player is 2800 or 2400. I play chess for fun and as long as we have enough players, clubs and tournaments here in Finland I am happy. To be honest in some way I hope we WONT have our Fischer some day, because I can imagine Finnish Chess Federation seeking more "Bobbys" and giving more support for few selected top players in the expense of ordinary patzers like majority of Finnish players (me included!). If someone is capable and willing to reach the top and fight for the title, good luck. But in the end of the day I am unwilling to mix chess and patriotism. |
| Posted by baseline uskidscompute.com 6/25/2003 15:49:41 Play online chess | peppe Message: You do not understand our culture. Competition is King in the USA. Baseball, Football, basketball, Auto racing etc. Many of our heros are winners. Michael Jordan is not admired because of his personality but because of what he can do on a basketball court Babe Ruth, Mickey Mantle, Hank Aaron are heros because they were great baseball players. Fischer was a winner, he didn't play for a draw with black and a win with white, he played to win every game. He is admired because of his great play and his detirmination to win. Robert Fischer earned his status as a player by winning. He gave patzers like me someone to root for, he certainly didn't take any of my oppertunities as a player. No one has ever said he was a great patriotic hero and no one says Michael Jordan is a great atriotic hero. But he is our Chess Hero and rightfully so because he was a guy from the wrong side of the tracks that achieved results that only a handful of chessplayers in the history of the game have. Only you seem to be mixing up chess with patriotism peppe. We admire the player R.J.Fischer. |
| Posted by rtrider uskidscompute.com 6/25/2003 17:21:52 Play online chess | gotc Message: rommel 13 you are absolutely right...it was fischer's age that made his game against byrne brilliant..when i was a kid fischer inspired me..and i think that all these years later the fact that he continues to inspire debate...is proof of his greatness as a player and all he has done for the game... |
| Posted by brucehum uskidscompute.com 6/25/2003 18:02:38 Play online chess | Interesting comment by Adorjan Message: GM Adorjan, who is known for his phrase "Black is OK!", writes in one of the last Chess Todays about how some weaker players feel they are NOT entlited to have an opinion when around stronger players. He goes on to say this is wrong, anyone can have one in chess. Then he says, related to Fischer: "I remember very well 1971, when I played the IBM GM tournament as a young qualifier IM. In parallel Fischer met Larsen in the match. Smyslov, Portisch, Uhlmann and quite a few top GMs of the IBM field got regular updates on that match. And I could see in their faces not envy, but confusion - they where shaken. The question that nobody verbalized was: why do we play chess, when this genius puts us into shame? So much for the relativity of being weak or strong!" |
| Posted by peppe_l uskidscompute.com 6/26/2003 05:02:05 Play online chess | Baseline Message: "You do not understand our culture. Competition is King in the USA. Baseball, Football, basketball, Auto racing etc. Many of our heros are winners. Michael Jordan is not admired because of his personality but because of what he can do on a basketball court Babe Ruth, Mickey Mantle, Hank Aaron are heros because they were great baseball players" Actually I do understand this part of your culture very well. Competition is important everywhere, here too winners tend to be the ones who become most popular. In US winning just plays even greater role and in many ways is more integral part of entire culture. My thesis is simple - I agree in pretty much in everything you say about American sports heroes, but I claim there is dundamental difference between Michael Jordan, Babe Ruth, Mickey Mantle, Hank Aaron and Robert J Fischer. Now why I claim Fischer was different? Simple. Who were/are Michael Jordan, Mickey Mantle and Hank Aaron competing against? Fellow Americans. Yes I know there are many foreigners in NBA for example, but its a team sport and all the teams are American. Baseball, Football, Basketball (I assume you were referring to American Football BTW?). These 3 are traditional American sports where US has better players than any other country. Auto racing is different of course, but since NASCAR is most popular series in US and very few follow F1 for example, American racing fans rarely see situations where their countrymen compete against elite European, South American, Asian racers (NASCAR still seems to have "Americans only" policy). People want to see American racers, American cars, American teams, American tracks... To put it simply, Americans want their winners American :-) Look at chess, how popular it was before Fischer when Russians had almost everything? How popular it was after Fischer became American winner and eventually American champion? I know you are saying all those people who found chess thanks to him only cared about how he played, but can someone who barely knows the rules really see the difference between Fischer and other GMs? Many American players I have talked to have revealed all they saw was American beating Russians, but after buying a chess set (thanks to Fischer bringing chess to mainstream) and few books they found out chess was a cool game. Only then they found Fischer the chess player. "Fischer was a winner, he didn't play for a draw with black and a win with white, he played to win every game. He is admired because of his great play and his detirmination to win. Robert Fischer earned his status as a player by winning." No question of his greatness as a chess player. "No one has ever said he was a great patriotic hero and no one says Michael Jordan is a great patriotic hero." Actually I have heard many Americans saying Fischer was a great patriotic or national hero... "But he is our Chess Hero and rightfully so because he was a guy from the wrong side of the tracks" Wrong side of the tracks = USA? Are you seriously claiming Cold War and patriotism (American beating Russians in their "own" game) had no influence whatsoever to his popularity? If yes, I truly dont know what to say. "that achieved results that only a handful of chessplayers in the history of the game have. Only you seem to be mixing up chess with patriotism peppe. We admire the player R.J.Fischer." YOU admire the player R.J.Fischer. I admire the player R.J.Fischer. But I have met quite a few Americans who dont really care about chess and have never played trough a single Bobby Fischer game. They admire "American genius who beat Russians in their own game" (exact quote :-) But if you say every single American who roots for Fischer does that ONLY because of his chess (including Americans who dont play chess at all but still root for Fischer), what can I say? If you say Cold War and patriotism had absolutely no effect to his popularity, what can I say? If you say there has never been Cold War or patriotism in the first place, what can I say? |
| Posted by baseline uskidscompute.com 6/26/2003 09:02:52 Play online chess | peppe_l Message: Tongue in cheek. I hear Gloria Gaynor plays chess and has this to say about Fischer. At first I was afraid, I was petrified keep thinking I could never live without you by my side. But, then I spent so many nights thinking how you did me wrong, and I grew strong and I learned how to get along. So now your back from outer space I just walked in to find you here with that long look upon your face. I should have changed that stupid lock I should have made you leave your key. If I’d known for just one second you’d be back to bother me. Go on now go, walk out the door, just turn around now your not welcome anymore. Weren’t you the one that tried to hurt me with good bye? Did you think I’d lay down and die? Oh no not I, I will survive. but then again maybe not. :o) Whatever R. J. Fischer strides across chess history as one of the Titans. |
| Posted by peppe_l uskidscompute.com 6/26/2003 10:04:54 Play online chess | Brilliant! Message: I never thought I Will Survive had such a deep message! :-) No question, Gloria Gaynor is wiser than many others... |
| Posted by bluebabygirl uskidscompute.com 6/29/2003 10:42:25 Play online chess | to peppe Message: you keep harping on Fischer's longevity. Actually he was among the elite for almost 2 decades,,retired for 20 years,,made a successful comeback which is unheard of in chess history and will likely remain so.-bbg |
| Posted by parrvert uskidscompute.com 6/29/2003 11:08:36 Play online chess | successful comeback? Message: If George Foreman returned to boxing and knocked out Muhammed Ali would that be a successful comeback? |
| Posted by baseline uskidscompute.com 6/29/2003 16:19:17 Play online chess | parrvert Message: you'd should make that the other way around. If Muhammed Ali returned to boxing and knocked out George Foreman would that be a successful comeback? |
| Posted by chessnovice uskidscompute.com 6/29/2003 23:23:09 Play online chess | ... Message: Good analysis, baseline , since Bobby Fischer returning to competitive chess is about as likely as Muhammed Ali knocking out George Foreman - let's not forget Ali's last two comebacks where he was destroyed by otherwise non-mainstream fighters. |
| Posted by edmaster uskidscompute.com 7/02/2003 14:41:20 Play online chess | ABOUT MY BUDDY FISCHER! Message: HE'S THE ONE AND ONLY NATIVE AMERICAN TO BECOME WORLD CHAMPION AGAIN TODAY! CHESSBOARD CLOSED! |
| Posted by edmaster uskidscompute.com 7/02/2003 14:42:45 Play online chess | ROBERT JAMES FISCHER Message: IS A VERY HONORABLE MAN! |
| Posted by winslow_hendershot uskidscompute.com 7/02/2003 21:44:35 Play online chess | I'm always surprised Message: when I read a joke somebody makes and have a little chuckle, and then in the very next post, someone begins to debate against the joke very seriously as if it were intended as a valid argument. For instance, peppe on 6/25 at 3:13 made a mildly amusing statement. Then in the next post sebazz seems to have missed the humor completely and responded as if peppe was serious. Maybe sebazz is making a joke on my and I am missing it. If I could play like Fischer, but I was doomed to slowly go crazy and paranoid, I think I would take the deal. I want to be as good as Fischer at chess. |
| Posted by coyotefan uskidscompute.com 7/03/2003 02:24:27 Play online chess | Remember, Fixcher turned against everything he wa Message: He turned against his race, religion and country. His playing in Yugoslavia then was the the same as the the New Yrok Yankees playing baseball in Iran now. He is a Jewish antisemite. He is a truly dispicable creature. |
| Posted by bogg uskidscompute.com 7/03/2003 02:33:07 Play online chess | coyotefan Message: It would only be the same if each member of the Yankees was offered a billion to play. The yankees are rich and employed. Fischer had a once in a life time chance to earn a lot of money. It was against policy for the government of the US to refuse him his exemption under the circumstances. He is a wee bit short of a full deck none the less. |
| Posted by coyotefan uskidscompute.com 7/03/2003 04:36:52 Play online chess | Not exactly Message: There were many places he could have gone to play the match legally. He was making a statement more than playing chess. It was an act of treason, and it was purposeful. |
| Posted by coyotefan uskidscompute.com 7/03/2003 04:44:00 Play online chess | bluebabygirl Message: Usually you are brilliant, but not this time. He did not make a successful comeback. He beat an old washed up opponent who did not have an original idea in 25 years. He did not beat Karpov, he beat Spassky. Any of the top 200 players could have done the same thing. He proved nothing. The games were boring. |
| Posted by peppe_l uskidscompute.com 7/03/2003 07:04:28 Play online chess | The first game of Message: Fischer - spassky match 1992 was actually very well played by Fischer, and far from boring. That even made some people believe that Fischer was still playing as well as 20 years ago. Of course soon it became clear that 20 years is 20 years... Some experts have estimated Fischer was still playing even on 2600 level - not bad at all! I believe the only people who thought his performance was heavily disappointing were those who had unrealistic expectations. Granted there are many people who have unrealistic expectations every time someone says the name Robert James Fischer :-) |
| Posted by thasangman uskidscompute.com 7/03/2003 07:18:43 Play online chess | ATTENTION!! Message: FISCHER IS DA BEST SO SHUT UP IF YOU DONT LIKE HIM!! |
| Posted by jean-marc uskidscompute.com 7/03/2003 20:28:37 Play online chess | Democracy... Message: I have trouble understanding how anyone can be accused of treason for playing chess. Surely in a democracy, people should be able to play chess wherever they want. Does the government have a right to tell us where we're allowed to play (they're little pieces of wood, not weapons of mass destruction). Isn't this why we fought the cold war ? I thought Big Brother in Orwell's 1984 was fiction... ...and they want to change the e4-e6's name to the "Freedom's Defence". |
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